Thanks, Evan, but I am still in a dark place. It's true that history didn't end on 11/5/2024, but it didn't end on 9/4/476, when Romulus Augustulus, the last Western Roman Emperor, was deposed. However, Western Europe then experienced a Dark Age, and King Arthur is a myth.
"Don't obey in advance" is good advice, but I am afraid that Dems still in office will do that, and move to the right. Also, calling out the MSM for their fucking right wing narrative is also good advice, but Dems are too timid to do so. Honestly, I don't know why they haven't been doing that for years. repubs learned to work the refs years ago, and it's paid off in spades for them.
Is all lost? Maybe not, Western Europe recovered, but it took hundreds of years. Yeah, I'm in a very dark place, because America is filled with evil people, who have enough money and media outlets to lie to enough people to get their way.
This is how dark I feel - if Sauron had regained The One Ring to Rule Them All, Middle Earth would be in a bad place, but not nearly as bad as the USA. Yeah, Sauron's evil can't compare to the billionaires and repubs ruling this country.
Sorry for the rant, but I am so angry right now. In 2016, I was sad, but I truly hate this country right now, and wonder if it's worth fighting for.
Empires should be destroyed, but we have a semblance of a democratic republic that has lasted 248 years, and I want that to continue . . .
Still steaming pissed that no one in our fight — I recall no one! — reminded voters that the Presodent will preside over the 250th anniversary celebration of the Declaration of Independence. Can’t even.
We live under minority rule. 30% of the electorate voted for a literal treasonous traitor. 30% voted for an experienced and talented patriot.
40% did not vote. Did Not Vote won! By a lot.
all for now, now the fight, angry and weary — b.rad
This is all exactly what I needed to hear right now.
I think literally any other person on the planet: Nikki Haley, Ron Desantis, hell Beavis and Butthead Trump it would have been more palatable. The financial times article put it in perspective EVERY incumbent party got screwed by post covid backlash. I’d be angry but fine today if it wasn’t electing the worst human being on earth
Really I don’t want Democrats to do a single thing different policy wise. Joe Biden’s administration was the most economically liberal since FDR and it was also the most successful. The greatest challenge for Democrats is to somehow reach the voters they aren’t reaching to understand that.
It’s failing Americans, especially those who are going to be most hurt by right wing bullshit, if it’s not universally known what you are voting for. I can understand when an asshole votes red. I will never ever forgive the number of voters this election who genuinely didn’t know what they were doing.
I have a couple of bucks to give to truth tellers. I’ve given up on mainstream media - I’m hoarse from screaming at the TV. Glad to be able to support you in my own small way.
It's funny. All that fussing those MAGA shitasses did about whether Kamala was black or not. Then they get the ballot: "Oh, she's black alright! I'm voting for Trump!"
And this campaign was better than any previous one! She went on Call Her Daddy! She did non-traditional media! I mean, maybe the lesson is that she should have done Joe Rogan instead of (or in addition to) Bret Baier, just to pierce the bubble a bit more, but I don't think you can say she didn't go to voters.
We are drowning in the right-wing propaganad flood and I don't know HOW we can break through...everyone in that bubble has been conditioned for decades (their entire lives for a lot of them) that we are evil baby-murdering communists coming to cut off their balls and make them slaves.
I believe that too - I posted above. But I think there's hope in the fact that the hard core right are still not a majority, and there are other people we can reach who voted for Biden in 2020 but sat this one out.
But I don't think we can win with Fox viewers. Like Robyn said, they really do think we eat babies. We could invent a magic wand and use it to give them their hearts' desires and they would not accept them from our woke hands.
I think the focus should be on the people who voted for Biden but sat this one out. People who aren't soaking in a wingnut stew, but who see a Russian meme or two and start having "concerns".
I believe the right is better than us at creating and maintaining a shared reality. They have to be, since their reality doesn't exist on its own. We think because our reality is basically Reality, we don't have to do that kind of work. But we do.
You make a very salient point - whatever these goons have planned for us is going to be somewhat hobbled by rampant incompetence, infighting and inability. They'll either purge or bleed out the experts who do know what to do, and the ones that stick around could quite easily get up to some serious monkeywrenching and sabotaging the Very Bad Plans. That's not to say it's not gonna be bad, just that there will be plenty of shots fired at their own feet to go along with those directed at us.
As Jimmy Kimmel said the other night, all of us in the opposition (women, liberals, immigrants, LGBT+ folks, even those abroad like Ukrainians and Palestinians) are going to suffer. The thing is though – so are a lot of the people who voted for him, they just don't know it yet. They didn't listen to our warnings, and took our attempts to mitigate the harm in 2016-2020 as evidence our concerns were overblown.
Their incompetence is definitely going to hinder some of their worst impulses, along with the backstabbing that will inevitably happen, but I have to wonder and hope about some kind of popular uprising eventually. Nothing like Jan 6th, a peaceful movement, but when the people who thought they'd be safe finally realize they aren't. That they voted for the Leopards Eating People's Faces party. When the people who bought his lies about lowering inflation realize they've been had as prices skyrocket from tariffs. When millions lose their health insurance. When the only economic benefits go to Elon Musk and the rest of the oligarchs. When the Latinos that voted for him realize they don't actually make a distinction between "here illegally" and "here legally" like they thought.
We need to do our best to protect marginalized groups that we know will be targets, our neighbors and friends, but part of me is thinking let's just give the people who voted for him what they voted for — the real MAGA, unleashed. America needs to hit rock bottom before we can get better. It makes me feel like a terrible person for even thinking it, but experience may be the only effective teacher at this point.
The Dems tried that in 2010: fleeing Obama like he ws some sort of contagious devil for daring to get the ACA passed, and going all 'Republican-Lite' so all those people willl vote for them.
It lead to the most catstrophoic loss for the Dems in modern history because it let the GOP red wave in and they gerrymandered the FUCK outta the country.
Alsoe are drowning in reactionary, fascist propaganda, and I cannot see any way out of that.
Thanks Evan, true and useful items to keep in our heads. I have been hibernating from media, still mired in the sad. But the mere idea of Rachel channeling Molly ….. that’s enough to get me up and fighting again!
Not just the country needs saving, but the world. FDJT is incompetent, but the power behind the Republican Party is not. Leonard Leo, for example, is not incompetent, and he, along with others want to take over the country, and I very much fear they will.
I can't be optimistic, I haven't got that much longer.
PS: I like that thought about responding to the situations as they arise. The terror right now, the one that robs us of sleep, is all the things that MIGHT happen. Once we know what will happen, we can respond.
Yup! Don't worry and borrow trouble from the future, because the trouble will make itself clear when it's upon us.
Prepare, plan, get your vaccinations updated and your passport renewed, stock up on meds if you can, and make sure to hold your loved ones close and laugh whenever you can.
The problem with appealing to voters whose worldview conflicts with yours is that you'll give up your worldview, and since your policies flow from your worldview, you'll just be a copy of the other party, just not authentic.
A couple of things from a retired history professor:
(1) America is not Germany.
a. First of all, Germany in 1933 was truly in the midst of one HELL of a depression, massive inflation, etc., such as (thankfully) we have never seen in this country. To most voters back then, the Nazis had nowhere to go but up. The American economy is currently booming. MAGA has nowhere to go but down, considering their economic “policies”.
b. America is HUGE geographically (Germany is the size of Montana), and has huge geographic and geologic differences. There are the Rockies and the Sierras, huge, dangerous mountains, with deserts on the east side of them. Large deserts. There are a lot of people living off the grid on those deserts, in Nevada, Wyoming, even Montana. Guns are everywhere, and not just in conservative hands.
c. In 1933, the German population was around 66 million people. The American population is 330 million… that’s a lot of people to control, over a tremendous amount of territory. Half of the people of this country would have to be in the military in order to control the other half, and even then…
d. Unlike America today, 1930s Germany was a very racially homogenous place: even the Jews were German Jews - hard to tell from the rest of the populace. (It's amazing when you think of how much hate it took to kill so many people who looked just like them...) It was easy to persuade most of the population that they were the Master Race, and deserved all the land all around them to breed like white rabbits.
d. It’s important to remember that the 3rd Reich only lasted from 1933-1945. Years of hell for many. But then it was over. And from 1938-1945, its economy was based on war, war, war, and more war. And deficit spending. We’re good at deficit spending, but who (outside ourselves) are we going to fight against?
(2) The whole Project 2025 idea of mass deportations requires an army of personnel and trucks in order to carry it out. And a lot of blue states are already saying, we’re not going to help at all with this. Again, this is a vast country. I’m not sure that (outside of the red Southern states, Texas, Louisiana, Mississippi, Alabama, Florida, etc.) they’ll be able to pull it off. (I certainly hope they can’t.) For one thing, I don’t think there’s an actual strategic plan. Lots of talk, but no plans. MAGA is not the fairly well-oiled machine that the Nazi party became during the years 1933-1938 before they started WW2.
Love this!! Agree agree agree! We need to dig in right now, start campaigning right now, like Trump did in 2020. He used his indictments and all that mess as campaign fodder! Mostly, we need to figure out away to reach people that use various media that feeds them lies and distortions. We have to face the fact that most Americans don’t pay attention to politics until they see a ballot in the mail! Reach them early, some how. Finally my husband is raging about the fact that the sharifs campaign didn’t spend whatever money to run ads immediately after every fucking GOP transgender ad during football games countering their crap!Easy!! Duh!!
Thanks, Evan, but I am still in a dark place. It's true that history didn't end on 11/5/2024, but it didn't end on 9/4/476, when Romulus Augustulus, the last Western Roman Emperor, was deposed. However, Western Europe then experienced a Dark Age, and King Arthur is a myth.
"Don't obey in advance" is good advice, but I am afraid that Dems still in office will do that, and move to the right. Also, calling out the MSM for their fucking right wing narrative is also good advice, but Dems are too timid to do so. Honestly, I don't know why they haven't been doing that for years. repubs learned to work the refs years ago, and it's paid off in spades for them.
Is all lost? Maybe not, Western Europe recovered, but it took hundreds of years. Yeah, I'm in a very dark place, because America is filled with evil people, who have enough money and media outlets to lie to enough people to get their way.
This is how dark I feel - if Sauron had regained The One Ring to Rule Them All, Middle Earth would be in a bad place, but not nearly as bad as the USA. Yeah, Sauron's evil can't compare to the billionaires and repubs ruling this country.
Sorry for the rant, but I am so angry right now. In 2016, I was sad, but I truly hate this country right now, and wonder if it's worth fighting for.
Christianity destroyed the Roman Empire.
Empires should be destroyed, but we have a semblance of a democratic republic that has lasted 248 years, and I want that to continue . . .
Still steaming pissed that no one in our fight — I recall no one! — reminded voters that the Presodent will preside over the 250th anniversary celebration of the Declaration of Independence. Can’t even.
We live under minority rule. 30% of the electorate voted for a literal treasonous traitor. 30% voted for an experienced and talented patriot.
40% did not vote. Did Not Vote won! By a lot.
all for now, now the fight, angry and weary — b.rad
I'm too tired to get scrappy.
This is all exactly what I needed to hear right now.
I think literally any other person on the planet: Nikki Haley, Ron Desantis, hell Beavis and Butthead Trump it would have been more palatable. The financial times article put it in perspective EVERY incumbent party got screwed by post covid backlash. I’d be angry but fine today if it wasn’t electing the worst human being on earth
Really I don’t want Democrats to do a single thing different policy wise. Joe Biden’s administration was the most economically liberal since FDR and it was also the most successful. The greatest challenge for Democrats is to somehow reach the voters they aren’t reaching to understand that.
It’s failing Americans, especially those who are going to be most hurt by right wing bullshit, if it’s not universally known what you are voting for. I can understand when an asshole votes red. I will never ever forgive the number of voters this election who genuinely didn’t know what they were doing.
I cancelled my Times and Post subscriptions so
I have a couple of bucks to give to truth tellers. I’ve given up on mainstream media - I’m hoarse from screaming at the TV. Glad to be able to support you in my own small way.
It's funny. All that fussing those MAGA shitasses did about whether Kamala was black or not. Then they get the ballot: "Oh, she's black alright! I'm voting for Trump!"
𝘛𝘩𝘢𝘵, 𝘐 𝘸𝘰𝘶𝘭𝘥 𝘴𝘶𝘨𝘨𝘦𝘴𝘵 𝘪𝘴 𝘰𝘯𝘦 𝘰𝘧 𝘵𝘩𝘦 𝘮𝘰𝘴𝘵 𝘪𝘮𝘱𝘰𝘳𝘵𝘢𝘯𝘵 𝘭𝘦𝘴𝘴𝘰𝘯𝘴 𝘰𝘧 𝘵𝘩𝘪𝘴 𝘦𝘭𝘦𝘤𝘵𝘪𝘰𝘯. 𝘛𝘩𝘢𝘵 𝘶𝘯𝘵𝘪𝘭 𝘋𝘦𝘮𝘰𝘤𝘳𝘢𝘵𝘴 𝘢𝘤𝘵𝘶𝘢𝘭𝘭𝘺 𝘥𝘦𝘤𝘪𝘥𝘦 𝘵𝘰 𝘤𝘰𝘮𝘱𝘦𝘵𝘦 𝘪𝘯 𝘵𝘩𝘦 𝘴𝘱𝘢𝘤𝘦𝘴 𝘸𝘩𝘦𝘳𝘦 𝘵𝘩𝘦𝘴𝘦 𝘷𝘰𝘵𝘦𝘳𝘴 𝘢𝘤𝘵𝘶𝘢𝘭𝘭𝘺 𝘢𝘳𝘦, 𝘵𝘩𝘦𝘯 𝘮𝘢𝘯𝘺 𝘧𝘰𝘭𝘬𝘴 𝘢𝘳𝘦𝘯’𝘵 𝘨𝘰𝘪𝘯𝘨 𝘵𝘰 𝘬𝘯𝘰𝘸 𝘵𝘩𝘢𝘵 𝘙𝘦𝘱𝘶𝘣𝘭𝘪𝘤𝘢𝘯 𝘴𝘤𝘢𝘳𝘦𝘮𝘰𝘯𝘨𝘦𝘳𝘪𝘯𝘨 𝘢𝘣𝘰𝘶𝘵 𝘵𝘳𝘢𝘯𝘴 𝘴𝘶𝘳𝘨𝘦𝘳𝘪𝘦𝘴 𝘪𝘯 𝘵𝘩𝘦 𝘴𝘤𝘩𝘰𝘰𝘭 𝘯𝘶𝘳𝘴𝘦’𝘴 𝘰𝘧𝘧𝘪𝘤𝘦 𝘢𝘯𝘥 𝘵𝘳𝘢𝘯𝘴 𝘸𝘰𝘮𝘦𝘯 𝘪𝘯𝘷𝘢𝘥𝘪𝘯𝘨 𝘴𝘱𝘰𝘳𝘵𝘴 𝘢𝘯𝘥 𝘬𝘪𝘥𝘴 𝘥𝘦𝘮𝘢𝘯𝘥𝘪𝘯𝘨 𝘵𝘰 𝘪𝘥𝘦𝘯𝘵𝘪𝘧𝘺 𝘢𝘴 “𝘧𝘶𝘳𝘳𝘪𝘦𝘴” 𝘢𝘯𝘥 𝘶𝘴𝘦 𝘭𝘪𝘵𝘵𝘦𝘳𝘣𝘰𝘹𝘦𝘴 𝘢𝘵 𝘴𝘤𝘩𝘰𝘰𝘭 𝘢𝘳𝘦 𝘭𝘪𝘦𝘴.
And this campaign was better than any previous one! She went on Call Her Daddy! She did non-traditional media! I mean, maybe the lesson is that she should have done Joe Rogan instead of (or in addition to) Bret Baier, just to pierce the bubble a bit more, but I don't think you can say she didn't go to voters.
We are drowning in the right-wing propaganad flood and I don't know HOW we can break through...everyone in that bubble has been conditioned for decades (their entire lives for a lot of them) that we are evil baby-murdering communists coming to cut off their balls and make them slaves.
I believe that too - I posted above. But I think there's hope in the fact that the hard core right are still not a majority, and there are other people we can reach who voted for Biden in 2020 but sat this one out.
"WORKED, with Black and Latino men and white women!" And OVERWELMINGLY for white men. Please don't forget that orange bag of shit's greatest base.
👆👆👆👆👆
Right on. NOBODY goes under the bus.
But I don't think we can win with Fox viewers. Like Robyn said, they really do think we eat babies. We could invent a magic wand and use it to give them their hearts' desires and they would not accept them from our woke hands.
I think the focus should be on the people who voted for Biden but sat this one out. People who aren't soaking in a wingnut stew, but who see a Russian meme or two and start having "concerns".
I believe the right is better than us at creating and maintaining a shared reality. They have to be, since their reality doesn't exist on its own. We think because our reality is basically Reality, we don't have to do that kind of work. But we do.
You make a very salient point - whatever these goons have planned for us is going to be somewhat hobbled by rampant incompetence, infighting and inability. They'll either purge or bleed out the experts who do know what to do, and the ones that stick around could quite easily get up to some serious monkeywrenching and sabotaging the Very Bad Plans. That's not to say it's not gonna be bad, just that there will be plenty of shots fired at their own feet to go along with those directed at us.
As Jimmy Kimmel said the other night, all of us in the opposition (women, liberals, immigrants, LGBT+ folks, even those abroad like Ukrainians and Palestinians) are going to suffer. The thing is though – so are a lot of the people who voted for him, they just don't know it yet. They didn't listen to our warnings, and took our attempts to mitigate the harm in 2016-2020 as evidence our concerns were overblown.
Their incompetence is definitely going to hinder some of their worst impulses, along with the backstabbing that will inevitably happen, but I have to wonder and hope about some kind of popular uprising eventually. Nothing like Jan 6th, a peaceful movement, but when the people who thought they'd be safe finally realize they aren't. That they voted for the Leopards Eating People's Faces party. When the people who bought his lies about lowering inflation realize they've been had as prices skyrocket from tariffs. When millions lose their health insurance. When the only economic benefits go to Elon Musk and the rest of the oligarchs. When the Latinos that voted for him realize they don't actually make a distinction between "here illegally" and "here legally" like they thought.
We need to do our best to protect marginalized groups that we know will be targets, our neighbors and friends, but part of me is thinking let's just give the people who voted for him what they voted for — the real MAGA, unleashed. America needs to hit rock bottom before we can get better. It makes me feel like a terrible person for even thinking it, but experience may be the only effective teacher at this point.
"𝘉𝘶𝘵 𝘰𝘯𝘦 𝘵𝘩𝘪𝘯𝘨 𝘵𝘩𝘢𝘵 𝘸𝘦 𝘥𝘰 𝘯𝘰𝘵 𝘩𝘢𝘷𝘦 𝘵𝘰 𝘥𝘰, 𝘢𝘯𝘥 𝘮𝘶𝘴𝘵 𝘯𝘰𝘵 𝘥𝘰, 𝘪𝘴 𝘭𝘪𝘴𝘵𝘦𝘯 𝘵𝘰 𝘢𝘴𝘴𝘩𝘰𝘭𝘦𝘴 𝘵𝘦𝘭𝘭𝘪𝘯𝘨 𝘶𝘴 𝘵𝘰 𝘮𝘰𝘷𝘦 𝘵𝘰 𝘵𝘩𝘦 𝘳𝘪𝘨𝘩𝘵 𝘵𝘰 𝘢𝘱𝘱𝘦𝘢𝘭 𝘵𝘰 𝘮𝘰𝘳𝘦 𝘮𝘰𝘥𝘦𝘳𝘢𝘵𝘦 𝘷𝘰𝘵𝘦𝘳𝘴, 𝘵𝘰 𝘤𝘰𝘮𝘱𝘳𝘰𝘮𝘪𝘴𝘦 𝘰𝘶𝘳 𝘱𝘳𝘪𝘯𝘤𝘪𝘱𝘭𝘦𝘴 𝘢𝘯𝘥 𝘷𝘢𝘭𝘶𝘦𝘴 𝘪𝘯 𝘰𝘳𝘥𝘦𝘳 𝘵𝘰 𝘴𝘰𝘮𝘦𝘩𝘰𝘸 𝘮𝘢𝘨𝘪𝘤𝘢𝘭𝘭𝘺 𝘢𝘱𝘱𝘦𝘢𝘭 𝘵𝘰 𝘔𝘈𝘎𝘈 𝘳𝘢𝘤𝘪𝘴𝘵𝘴, 𝘴𝘦𝘹𝘪𝘴𝘵𝘴 𝘢𝘯𝘥 𝘢𝘯𝘵𝘪-𝘓𝘎𝘉𝘛𝘘 𝘭𝘰𝘴𝘦𝘳𝘴."
The Dems tried that in 2010: fleeing Obama like he ws some sort of contagious devil for daring to get the ACA passed, and going all 'Republican-Lite' so all those people willl vote for them.
It lead to the most catstrophoic loss for the Dems in modern history because it let the GOP red wave in and they gerrymandered the FUCK outta the country.
Alsoe are drowning in reactionary, fascist propaganda, and I cannot see any way out of that.
Regarding the Gallego article, it's Vox, not Fox.
haha, what a typo. thanks!
Understandable, Evan, given how often Faux NewZ comes up in discussion.
Thanks Evan, true and useful items to keep in our heads. I have been hibernating from media, still mired in the sad. But the mere idea of Rachel channeling Molly ….. that’s enough to get me up and fighting again!
Not just the country needs saving, but the world. FDJT is incompetent, but the power behind the Republican Party is not. Leonard Leo, for example, is not incompetent, and he, along with others want to take over the country, and I very much fear they will.
I can't be optimistic, I haven't got that much longer.
I share your pain
PS: I like that thought about responding to the situations as they arise. The terror right now, the one that robs us of sleep, is all the things that MIGHT happen. Once we know what will happen, we can respond.
Yup! Don't worry and borrow trouble from the future, because the trouble will make itself clear when it's upon us.
Prepare, plan, get your vaccinations updated and your passport renewed, stock up on meds if you can, and make sure to hold your loved ones close and laugh whenever you can.
The problem with appealing to voters whose worldview conflicts with yours is that you'll give up your worldview, and since your policies flow from your worldview, you'll just be a copy of the other party, just not authentic.
A couple of things from a retired history professor:
(1) America is not Germany.
a. First of all, Germany in 1933 was truly in the midst of one HELL of a depression, massive inflation, etc., such as (thankfully) we have never seen in this country. To most voters back then, the Nazis had nowhere to go but up. The American economy is currently booming. MAGA has nowhere to go but down, considering their economic “policies”.
b. America is HUGE geographically (Germany is the size of Montana), and has huge geographic and geologic differences. There are the Rockies and the Sierras, huge, dangerous mountains, with deserts on the east side of them. Large deserts. There are a lot of people living off the grid on those deserts, in Nevada, Wyoming, even Montana. Guns are everywhere, and not just in conservative hands.
c. In 1933, the German population was around 66 million people. The American population is 330 million… that’s a lot of people to control, over a tremendous amount of territory. Half of the people of this country would have to be in the military in order to control the other half, and even then…
d. Unlike America today, 1930s Germany was a very racially homogenous place: even the Jews were German Jews - hard to tell from the rest of the populace. (It's amazing when you think of how much hate it took to kill so many people who looked just like them...) It was easy to persuade most of the population that they were the Master Race, and deserved all the land all around them to breed like white rabbits.
d. It’s important to remember that the 3rd Reich only lasted from 1933-1945. Years of hell for many. But then it was over. And from 1938-1945, its economy was based on war, war, war, and more war. And deficit spending. We’re good at deficit spending, but who (outside ourselves) are we going to fight against?
(2) The whole Project 2025 idea of mass deportations requires an army of personnel and trucks in order to carry it out. And a lot of blue states are already saying, we’re not going to help at all with this. Again, this is a vast country. I’m not sure that (outside of the red Southern states, Texas, Louisiana, Mississippi, Alabama, Florida, etc.) they’ll be able to pull it off. (I certainly hope they can’t.) For one thing, I don’t think there’s an actual strategic plan. Lots of talk, but no plans. MAGA is not the fairly well-oiled machine that the Nazi party became during the years 1933-1938 before they started WW2.
Finally, a very helpful article for the future:
https://www.patheos.com/blogs/slacktivist/2024/11/09/do-not-obey-in-advance/
Love this!! Agree agree agree! We need to dig in right now, start campaigning right now, like Trump did in 2020. He used his indictments and all that mess as campaign fodder! Mostly, we need to figure out away to reach people that use various media that feeds them lies and distortions. We have to face the fact that most Americans don’t pay attention to politics until they see a ballot in the mail! Reach them early, some how. Finally my husband is raging about the fact that the sharifs campaign didn’t spend whatever money to run ads immediately after every fucking GOP transgender ad during football games countering their crap!Easy!! Duh!!